European engine (or twin carb :-)

[howardsugarman]

hi fellow 600's owner. if someone can point to me the
direct to getting a clutch and pressure plate and
throw out bearing for an an600?
Thanks, Howie
--- Miles wrote:

> I used to belong to Kefurt's club, I still have some
> of the decals.
> He offered many things he could not produce such as
> all fiberglass
> front ends, 4 wheel disc brakes, he offered special
> towing clutches,
> a high performance engine kit which included a 180
> degree crank,
> special head & cam that would produce 60hp. Later he
> would take my
> money to belong to the 600 club, but there was never
> anything in the
> newsletters about 600's only Civics.
> I did visit his shop once on Lankershim BL. I bought
> a set of mags &
> 2 Honda 600 coupe toys. He gave me a copy of his
> Honda 600 database
> on a 5 1/4" floppy which no one could read as it was
> on something
> like a TRS80 or similar computer. He offerend me I
> could buy out his
> huge inventory for 10 cents on the dollar but would
> have to buy it
> all.
> Miles
> --- In
2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
,
> "twincarb600"
> wrote:
> > Well here is the true about the twincarb 600.
> Honda never made a
> > production dual carb 600. Long ago back in the
> 70's or 80's there
> > was report of a racing dual carb top end from Mike
> Kefurt in North
> > Hollywood CA. I personally saw the setup that he
> had and I kind of
> > questioned it when i saw it in the early 80's.
> Kefurt wanted
> > $1200.00 back then for this special top end. At
> the time I didn't
> > have enough information as to weather it was real
> and or the money
> to
> > purchase it from him. Over the years of
> collecting different
> manuals
> > from all over the world I have never come across
> anything that
> states
> > that one was ever produced. What I have is truly
> a 360 head and
> the
> > beginnings of modification to use on a 600 motor.
> The 360 motors
> in
> > japan have a different oiling passages than what
> is used by the 600
> > motors. Someone at some time started to convert
> the original 600
> > lower cases and cylinders for the correct oiling
> that this head
> > needs. I kind of have a feeling that this head
> and rest of the
> motor
> > was what I saw when Kefurt had it. It appears
> that nobody ever
> > completed this project and some time I plan on
> doing so. As far as
> > the bolt pattern goes there is no difference
> between the 360 and
> 600
> > engine, it is only the oil passages that are
> different. the oil
> > comes up from the lower end in a separate hole
> insteaded of the
> rear
> > head bolts. The cylinders that came with this
> motor have already
> > been moded for these extra holes. Something that
> also is done in
> > Japan is to knock the sleeves out of the cylinders
> and put 74mm
> > sleeves and piston in place. What they end up
> using is the stock
> > 74mm 600 piston and machine the dome to fit the
> combustion camber
> of
> > the 360 head. I also have a set of those pstons
> as well.
> Something
> > else that was made up for this motor was a cam
> with an adjustable
> > sprocket. This way when the head gets milled you
> can adjust out
> the
> > cam timing to keep the valves timed out properly.
> I have seen with
> > the 360 punched out to 500 cc and different carbs
> added to it push
> > around 90hp. They also twist the crankshafts on
> them and call them
> > 180 cranks as well. Maybe some day I'll get time
> to finish what
> some
> > one started and maybe twist a crank for this motor
> as well. I'll
> see
> > about adding the picture of the pistons to the
> photo page.
> > Robert
> > --- In
2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
, Micka�l
> wrote:
> > > It's really a twin carb head for 600 or a
> modified 360 twin carb
> > head?
> > > I've compare the heads and the head bolts place
> are different.
> > > Can you compare camshaft housing gasket?
> http://autos.ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/ ... s/view/687
> > 2?
> > > b=2
> > > any picture of cambers?
> > > Thanks
> > > --- In
2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
, "Miles"
> wrote:
> > > > And just for your information, I had the
> chance to buy a Twin
> > Carb
> > > > 600cc engine and passed on it because the
> owner wanted me to
> take
> > all
> > > > the junked out cars & parts and wouldn't just
> let me have the
> > engine.
> > > > Our group member, user name twincarb600, was
> able to buy that
> > same
> > > > engine, there is or was pics of it in the
> Photos section.
> > > > Miles

Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

[twincarb600]

I belonged to it as well. He mentioned the 180 crank but never said
he had one when I was there. I can't remember how I came up with him
but remember going to his house and seeing the place packed with 600
parts. The back yard was packed with dead 600's and there was no
room to even move around. I have some pictures someplace of all of
this. He then got into trying to import the Honda City car around
1984 I think. He had the remains of the from clip of one with the
turbo engine squeezed in the backyard. This was the crash test car
for getting DOT sign off. I still think I have some of the old news
letters that I could scan sometime and post or send off to Steve for
his web site. I only seen his shop on Lankershim once. I think when
I was there he wasn't there it was just guys working for him. I was
thinking I heard he got into some issue with Honda over trying to
remanufacture the 600 cars or something like that. I just wonder
what happened to everything he had? I think his shop was M.I.K
Automotive wasn't it? I think he is now selling some sort of mystery
secret oil in Las Vegas now. He has a website but it had nothing but
bogus mailbox store addresses listed for his operations.

--- In
2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
, "Miles" wrote:
> I used to belong to Kefurt's club, I still have some of the decals.
> He offered many things he could not produce such as all fiberglass
> front ends, 4 wheel disc brakes, he offered special towing
clutches,
> a high performance engine kit which included a 180 degree crank,
> special head & cam that would produce 60hp. Later he would take my
> money to belong to the 600 club, but there was never anything in
the
> newsletters about 600's only Civics.
> I did visit his shop once on Lankershim BL. I bought a set of mags
&
> 2 Honda 600 coupe toys. He gave me a copy of his Honda 600 database
> on a 5 1/4" floppy which no one could read as it was on something
> like a TRS80 or similar computer. He offerend me I could buy out
his
> huge inventory for 10 cents on the dollar but would have to buy it
> all.
> Miles
> --- In
2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
, "twincarb600"
> wrote:
> > Well here is the true about the twincarb 600. Honda never made a
> > production dual carb 600. Long ago back in the 70's or 80's
there
> > was report of a racing dual carb top end from Mike Kefurt in
North
> > Hollywood CA. I personally saw the setup that he had and I kind
of
> > questioned it when i saw it in the early 80's. Kefurt wanted
> > $1200.00 back then for this special top end. At the time I
didn't
> > have enough information as to weather it was real and or the
money
> to
> > purchase it from him. Over the years of collecting different
> manuals
> > from all over the world I have never come across anything that
> states
> > that one was ever produced. What I have is truly a 360 head and
> the
> > beginnings of modification to use on a 600 motor. The 360 motors
> in
> > japan have a different oiling passages than what is used by the
600
> > motors. Someone at some time started to convert the original 600
> > lower cases and cylinders for the correct oiling that this head
> > needs. I kind of have a feeling that this head and rest of the
> motor
> > was what I saw when Kefurt had it. It appears that nobody ever
> > completed this project and some time I plan on doing so. As far
as
> > the bolt pattern goes there is no difference between the 360 and
> 600
> > engine, it is only the oil passages that are different. the oil
> > comes up from the lower end in a separate hole insteaded of the
> rear
> > head bolts. The cylinders that came with this motor have already
> > been moded for these extra holes. Something that also is done in
> > Japan is to knock the sleeves out of the cylinders and put 74mm
> > sleeves and piston in place. What they end up using is the stock
> > 74mm 600 piston and machine the dome to fit the combustion camber
> of
> > the 360 head. I also have a set of those pstons as well.
> Something
> > else that was made up for this motor was a cam with an adjustable
> > sprocket. This way when the head gets milled you can adjust out
> the
> > cam timing to keep the valves timed out properly. I have seen
with
> > the 360 punched out to 500 cc and different carbs added to it
push
> > around 90hp. They also twist the crankshafts on them and call
them
> > 180 cranks as well. Maybe some day I'll get time to finish what
> some
> > one started and maybe twist a crank for this motor as well. I'll
> see
> > about adding the picture of the pistons to the photo page.
> > Robert
> > --- In
2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
, Micka�l wrote:
> > > It's really a twin carb head for 600 or a modified 360 twin
carb
> > head?
> > > I've compare the heads and the head bolts place are different.
> > > Can you compare camshaft housing gasket?
http://autos.ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/ ... s/view/687
> > 2?
> > > b=2
> > > any picture of cambers?
> > > Thanks
> > > --- In
2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
, "Miles"
wrote:
> > > > And just for your information, I had the chance to buy a Twin
> > Carb
> > > > 600cc engine and passed on it because the owner wanted me to
> take
> > all
> > > > the junked out cars & parts and wouldn't just let me have the
> > engine.
> > > > Our group member, user name twincarb600, was able to buy that
> > same
> > > > engine, there is or was pics of it in the Photos section.
> > > > Miles

[Love]

Mike, aka Miros, if I got it right, was trying to sell what looks like, a Russian version of the Fiat Panda (only available in Europe).  The website originally showed a gas engine, but now has morphed into a electric car.
According to website www.okaauto.com  " OKA AUTO USA is a division of MIROX Corporation which is the exclusive importer and manufacturer's U.S. representative for "SEAZ" and "KAZ" in Russia, which manufacture the OKA mini cars."
twincarb600 wrote:

> I belonged to it as well. He mentioned the 180 crank but never said > he had one when I was there. I can't remember how I came up with him > but remember going to his house and seeing the place packed with 600 > parts. The back yard was packed with dead 600's and there was no > room to even move around. I have some pictures someplace of all of > this. He then got into trying to import the Honda City car around > 1984 I think. He had the remains of the from clip of one with the > turbo engine squeezed in the backyard. This was the crash test car > for getting DOT sign off. I still think I have some of the old news > letters that I could scan sometime and post or send off to Steve for > his web site.
> I only seen his shop on Lankershim once. I think when
> I was there he wasn't there it was just guys working for him. I was > thinking I heard he got into some issue with Honda over trying to > remanufacture the 600 cars or something like that. I just wonder > what happened to everything he had? I think his shop was M.I.K > Automotive wasn't it? I think he is now selling some sort of mystery > secret oil in Las Vegas now. He has a website but it had nothing but > bogus mailbox store addresses listed for his operations.
> --- In
> 2cylinderhondas@ yahoogroups. com
> , "Miles" wrote:
> > I used to belong to Kefurt's club, I still have some of the decals.
> > He offered many things he could not produce such as all fiberglass > > front ends, 4 wheel disc brakes, he offered special towing > clutches, > > a high performance engine kit which included > a 180 degree crank, > > special head & cam that would produce 60hp. Later he would take my > > money to belong to the 600 club, but there was never anything in > the > > newsletters about 600's only Civics.
> > I did visit his shop once on Lankershim BL. I bought a set of mags > & > > 2 Honda 600 coupe toys. He gave me a copy of his Honda 600 database > > on a 5 1/4" floppy which no one could read as it was on something > > like a TRS80 or similar computer. He offerend me I could buy out > his > > huge inventory for 10 cents on the dollar but would have to buy it > > all.
> > Miles
> > --- In
> 2cylinderhondas@ yahoogroups. com
> , "twincarb600"
> > wrote:
> > > Well here is the true about the twincarb 600. Honda never made a
> production dual carb 600. Long ago back in the 70's or 80's > there > > > was report of a racing dual carb top end from Mike Kefurt in > North > > > Hollywood CA. I personally saw the setup that he had and I kind > of > > > questioned it when i saw it in the early 80's. Kefurt wanted > > > $1200.00 back then for this special top end. At the time I > didn't > > > have enough information as to weather it was real and or the > money > > to > > > purchase it from him. Over the years of collecting different > > manuals > > > from all over the world I have never come across anything that > > states > > > that one was ever produced. What I have is truly a 360 head and > > the > > > beginnings of modification to use on a 600 motor. The 360 motors > > in > > > japan have a different oiling passages than what is used by the > 600 > > > motors. Someone at some > time started to convert the original 600 > > > lower cases and cylinders for the correct oiling that this head > > > needs. I kind of have a feeling that this head and rest of the > > motor > > > was what I saw when Kefurt had it. It appears that nobody ever > > > completed this project and some time I plan on doing so. As far > as > > > the bolt pattern goes there is no difference between the 360 and > > 600 > > > engine, it is only the oil passages that are different. the oil > > > comes up from the lower end in a separate hole insteaded of the > > rear > > > head bolts. The cylinders that came with this motor have already > > > been moded for these extra holes. Something that also is done in > > > Japan is to knock the sleeves out of the cylinders and put 74mm > > > sleeves and piston in place. What they end up using is the stock > > > 74mm 600 piston and > machine the dome to fit the combustion camber > > of > > > the 360 head. I also have a set of those pstons as well.
> > Something
> > > else that was made up for this motor was a cam with an adjustable > > > sprocket. This way when the head gets milled you can adjust out > > the > > > cam timing to keep the valves timed out properly. I have seen > with > > > the 360 punched out to 500 cc and different carbs added to it > push > > > around 90hp. They also twist the crankshafts on them and call > them > > > 180 cranks as well. Maybe some day I'll get time to finish what > > some > > > one started and maybe twist a crank for this motor as well. I'll > > see > > > about adding the picture of the pistons to the photo page.
> > > Robert
> > > --- In
> 2cylinderhondas@ yahoogroups. com
> , Micka�l wrote:
> > > > It's really a twin carb head for 600 or a modified 360 twin > carb > > > head?
> > > > I've compare the heads and the head bolts place are different.
> > > > Can you compare camshaft housing gasket?
> http://autos. ph.groups. yahoo.com/ group/2cylinderh ondas/photos/ view/687 > > > 2?
> > > > b=2
> > > > any picture of cambers?
> > > > Thanks
> > > > --- In
> 2cylinderhondas@ yahoogroups. com
> , "Miles"
> wrote:
> > > > > And just for your information, I had
> the chance to buy a Twin
> > > Carb
> > > > > 600cc engine and passed on it because the owner wanted me to > > take > > > all > > > > > the junked out cars & parts and wouldn't just let me have the > > > engine.
> > > > > Our group member, user name twincarb600, was able to buy that > > > same > > > > > engine, there is or was pics of it in the Photos section.
> > > > > Miles

[twincarb600]

They had the twin carb 360's in Japan in know for sure. In Japan
they did all sorts of mods to the motors from diiferent carbs to
changing the chain sprockets. They would also add another gear to
the transmission when they changed the sprockets to give them a new
1st gear. I think the stock twin carb 360 was rated a 32hp at
9000rpm. There are people in Japan that sell some of the mods for
the 360 motor. I have purchased some of the things that are common
to the 600's. I'm thinking that they took 2 cams just to make one
180 camshaft. It has been awhile since I have seen one of them.
I know if you look at a 45hp 600 cam next to a late model cam it
looks massive. Back in the 80's you could send a cam off to Isky in
California and have it reground. I think it cost $70.00 back then
and came with lash caps for the valve stems. Back in the 80's I ran
a coupe with the 45hp cam and large bore carb. I never did anything
to the exhaust so I probably lost some power there. I know driving
my stock one now days it doesn't proform like my one in the early
80's did. I was in the gas pedal alot and would spin it up to
8000rpm between gears. Anything over 8k the valves would start to
float and it would fall on its face. One of these days I'll have to
find another rust free body and spin that old motor up again for
fun.
Robert

[twincarb600]

Miroslav if I remember right. That would be his website. I tried
looking for his place in Vegas from all of the addresses he shows and
never found anything. They were all rental mailbox stores in
diferent places. He says that this mystery oil has been around for
years but yet he never talked about it when he was playing honda
600. He actully done some sort of test and said that castrol 20/50
was the oil in his honda news letters. On this site he references MIK
as being the shop in North Hollywood that did his testing for him. GO
FIGURE.
Robert

[Miles]

Miroslav Kefurt, born and raised in a small Amish village outside of
Wengen Switzerland. No, sorry, just made that up. But it was Miroslav
Kefurt. He had the grey market Honda City and another car he was
trying to import from I believe Czechoslovakia or Poland. He later
somehow got involved with trying to bring in the Messer KR50 Kabrio.
I just found the brochure and envelope he mailed it in. The return
address is MK Ventures LTD. 4111 Pacific Coast Highway, Torrance Ca.
The KR50 looks like the Messerschmitt KR200 micro car but only had a
50cc engine and was produced in Japan. I received the brochure back
in 1986.
My friend and I tried to find his address when we went to LA, but
there was no such address to be found. So, today, just now I Googled
that address and here's my results:
Punjab India Restaurant
4111, Pacific Coast Highway
Torrance,
Los Angeles 90505
Interesting.

[Kathleen]

Mike (Miroslav) was my mechanic for several years beginning sometime
in the mid-80's. First, Robertson Honda dumped me, then J.C. Imports
(right across the street) dumped me and referred me to M.I.K. His
shop was on the corner of Lankershim Blvd. and Strathern in N.
Hollywood. The first thing I had to have done was an engine rebuild.
Sadly, I didn't know enough then to choose a rebuild instead of an
engine swap. The next person to work on my car told me the engine
Mike gave me had water lines on it from sitting in water. Also, Mike
liked to use a lot of gasket goop to put things together. There was
usually a ring of red around his repairs. But he was the only one I
could find, willing and able to do the work! I even asked the parts
dept. at Robertson to tell me who was buying a lot of 600 parts. No
one. (And that was when it was still pretty easy to get parts.)
Eventually, Mike started pushing Bertone cars with the same fervor
he'd had for Hondas. Not long after that, his shop closed. (I
think that was before 1990.)
Happy ending: last May, I married Tim Mings, so now I don't have to
worry about finding a mechanic anymore (unless he dumps me for a
Model-T). Kathleen

[friend]

I too questioned the dual carb setup.  And said as such a few years back.  I have an original Honda 600 head that i very different but still a single carb unit.  To have an original head modified to accept two carbs is doable, but expensive.  The head would have to be recast and machined.  But then why not make two, instead of just one?  I asked if a regular honda 600 head could be laid alongside the two carb head.  that has not been done to my knowledge.  Looking at the oil supply to the cam box is very different on the 360 from the 600 and the head gaskets don't even line up.   I always said it is a 360 unit.
Bill

> -----Original Message-----
> From:
> 2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com [mailto:2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com] > On > Behalf Of > twincarb600 > Sent:
> Monday, October 29, 2007 5:54
> PM
> To:
> 2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
> Subject:
> [2cylinderhondas] Re: European engine (or twin carb :-)
> Well here is the true about the twincarb 600. Honda never made a
> production dual carb 600. Long ago back in the 70's or 80's there > was > report of a racing dual carb top end from Mike Kefurt in North > Hollywood > CA. I personally saw the setup that he had and I kind of > questioned it > when i saw it in the early 80's. Kefurt wanted > $1200.00 back then for this > special top end. At the time I didn't > have enough information as to > weather it was real and or the money to > purchase it from him. Over the > years of collecting different manuals > from all over the world I have never > come across anything that states > that one was ever produced. What I have > is truly a 360 head and the > beginnings of modification to use on a 600 > motor. The 360 motors in > japan have a different oiling passages than what > is used by the 600 > motors. Someone at some time started to convert the > original 600 > lower cases and cylinders for the correct oiling that this > head > needs. I kind of have a feeling that this head and rest of the motor
> was what I saw when Kefurt had it. It appears that nobody ever
> completed this project and some time I plan on doing so. As far as > the > bolt pattern goes there is no difference between the 360 and 600 > engine, > it is only the oil passages that are different. the oil > comes up from the > lower end in a separate hole insteaded of the rear > head bolts. The > cylinders that came with this motor have already > been moded for these > extra holes. Something that also is done in > Japan is to knock the sleeves > out of the cylinders and put 74mm > sleeves and piston in place. What they > end up using is the stock > 74mm 600 piston and machine the dome to fit the > combustion camber of > the 360 head. I also have a set of those pstons as > well. Something > else that was made up for this motor was a cam with an > adjustable > sprocket. This way when the head gets milled you can adjust out > the > cam timing to keep the valves timed out properly. I have seen with
> the 360 punched out to 500 cc and different carbs added to it push
> around 90hp. They also twist the crankshafts on them and call them > 180 > cranks as well. Maybe some day I'll get time to finish what some > one > started and maybe twist a crank for this motor as well. I'll see > about > adding the picture of the pistons to the photo page.
> Robert
> ---
> In
> 2cylinderhondas@ yahoogroups. com
> ,
> Micka�l wrote:
> > It's really a twin
> carb head for 600 or a modified 360 twin carb
> head?
> > I've compare
> the heads and the head bolts place are different.
> > Can you compare
> camshaft housing gasket?
> http://autos. ph.groups. yahoo.com/ group/2cylinderh ondas/photos/ view/687 > 2?
> b=2
> > any picture of cambers?
> > Thanks
> > --- In
> 2cylinderhondas@ yahoogroups. com
> ,
> "Miles" wrote:
> > > And just for your
> information, I had the chance to buy a Twin
> Carb
> > > 600cc
> engine and passed on it because the owner wanted me to take > all
> > the junked out cars & parts and wouldn't just let me have the
> engine.
> > > Our group member, user name
> twincarb600, was able to buy that
> same
> > > engine, there is or
> was pics of it in the Photos section.
> Miles

[friend]

From what is being said about this guy he needed to go....
Bill

> -----Original Message-----
> From:
> 2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com [mailto:2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com] > On > Behalf Of > Kathleen > Sent:
> Friday, November 02, 2007 8:10
> AM
> To:
> 2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
> Subject:
> [2cylinderhondas] Re: Kefurt
> Mike (Miroslav) was my mechanic for several years beginning sometime > in > the mid-80's. First, Robertson Honda dumped me, then J.C. Imports > (right > across the street) dumped me and referred me to M.I.K. His > shop was on the > corner of Lankershim Blvd. and Strathern in N.
> Hollywood. The first thing I
> had to have done was an engine rebuild.
> Sadly, I didn't know enough then to
> choose a rebuild instead of an
> engine swap. The next person to work on my
> car told me the engine
> Mike gave me had water lines on it from sitting in
> water. Also, Mike
> liked to use a lot of gasket goop to put things together.
> There was
> usually a ring of red around his repairs. But he was the only one > I > could find, willing and able to do the work! I even asked the > parts > dept. at Robertson to tell me who was buying a lot of 600 parts.
> No
> one. (And that was when it was still pretty easy to get parts.)
> Eventually, Mike started pushing Bertone cars with the same fervor > he'd > had for Hondas. Not long after that, his shop closed. (I > think that was > before 1990.) > Happy ending: last May, I married Tim Mings, so now I > don't have to > worry about finding a mechanic anymore (unless he dumps me > for a > Model-T). Kathleen

[jpro8071]

--- In 2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com, wrote:

> From what is being said about this guy he needed to go....
> Bill
> Kefurt or Mings?

;-)

> -----Original Message-----
> From:
2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:
2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
]On Behalf Of Kathleen
> Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 8:10 AM
> To:
2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [2cylinderhondas] Re: Kefurt
> Mike (Miroslav) was my mechanic for several years beginning sometime
> in the mid-80's. First, Robertson Honda dumped me, then J.C. Imports
> (right across the street) dumped me and referred me to M.I.K. His
> shop was on the corner of Lankershim Blvd. and Strathern in N.
> Hollywood. The first thing I had to have done was an engine rebuild.
> Sadly, I didn't know enough then to choose a rebuild instead of an
> engine swap. The next person to work on my car told me the engine
> Mike gave me had water lines on it from sitting in water. Also, Mike
> liked to use a lot of gasket goop to put things together. There was
> usually a ring of red around his repairs. But he was the only one I
> could find, willing and able to do the work! I even asked the parts
> dept. at Robertson to tell me who was buying a lot of 600 parts. No
> one. (And that was when it was still pretty easy to get parts.)
> Eventually, Mike started pushing Bertone cars with the same fervor
> he'd had for Hondas. Not long after that, his shop closed. (I
> think that was before 1990.)
> Happy ending: last May, I married Tim Mings, so now I don't have to
> worry about finding a mechanic anymore (unless he dumps me for a
> Model-T). Kathleen