oil

[T W S]

this is something i just wanted to pass along to anyone that might be more
knowledgable about oils in engines. I have an ultralight airplane with a half VW
engine in it and one of the gurus that�builds these things had this to say
about�the oil: This message is to inform you about a problem with the new motor
oils. There is a lot of information around about the reduction of ZDDP in oil
formulations. ZDDP is an extreme lubricant additive. The oil companies are
lowering the amounnt of it because of its effects on exhaust emissions. The VW
engine needs the extra lubricant that ZDDP provides. With traditional oil
formulations, I have had no problems reaching 1.000 hours time on an engine. I
now have had two engines with approximately 350 hours wear out bearings. From
what i see, its not a lack of oil pressure because both engines had good oil
pressure and oil temperature. It just looks like the oil is not lubricating
enough. What I am recomending is using either a diesel grade oil or a racing
oil. Both have higher amounts of ZDDP. There are ZDDP additives also. Synthetic
oils are not much better. I am by no means an expert scientist on this subject,
but this is the only answer i have to hteis problem. Scott Casler, Hummel
Engines�������������� I know he was writing this about VW engines but was
wondering if it might be applies with the 600s?��� Tim

[mterrens]

Yes, basically all correct.  I have heard this: only buy oils that DON'T say "energy conserving" on the round label on the front, similar to these...
http://www.aa1car.com/library/API_donut.gif  .
 Hopefully someone with more understanding on this as it relates to 600s will chime in.  Anyone here have an oil recommendation, given this issue?
Steve
www.honda600coupe.com

> ----- Original Message -----
> From:
> T W S
> To:
> anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
> Cc:
> anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
> Sent:
> Saturday, December 18, 2010 8:15
> PM
> Subject:
> [anzhonda600owners] oil
> this is something i just wanted to pass along to anyone that might be more
> knowledgable about oils in engines. I have an ultralight airplane with a > half VW > engine in it and one of the gurus that builds these things > had this to say > about the oil: This message is to inform you about a > problem with the new motor > oils. There is a lot of information around > about the reduction of ZDDP in oil > formulations. ZDDP is an extreme > lubricant additive. The oil companies are > lowering the amounnt of it > because of its effects on exhaust emissions. The VW > engine needs the extra > lubricant that ZDDP provides. With traditional oil > formulations, I have > had no problems reaching 1.000 hours time on an engine. I > now have had two > engines with approximately 350 hours wear out bearings. From > what i see, > its not a lack of oil pressure because both engines had good oil > pressure > and oil temperature. It just looks like the oil is not lubricating > enough.
> What I am recomending is using either a diesel grade oil or a racing > oil.
> Both have higher amounts of ZDDP. There are ZDDP additives also. Synthetic
> oils are not much better. I am by no means an expert scientist on this > subject, > but this is the only answer i have to hteis problem. Scott > Casler, Hummel
> Engines
> I know he was writing this about VW engines but was
> wondering if it might
> be applies with the 600s?    Tim

[lyletrudell]

I agree also, ZDDP is needed for all of our classic air cooled motorcycle engine designs. I will run a 20w-50 motorcycle oil. These oils are designed for high RPM/loads and also for transmission lubrication. Just what our Honda 600's need.
A few bucks more but worth it!
Lyle

--- In
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
, Steven Michelsen wrote:
> Yes, basically all correct. I have heard this: only buy oils that DON'T say "energy conserving" on the round label on the front, similar to these...
http://www.aa1car.com/library/API_donut.gif
. Hopefully someone with more understanding on this as it relates to 600s will chime in. Anyone here have an oil recommendation, given this issue?
> Steve
> www.honda600coupe.com
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: T W S
> To:
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
> Cc:
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Saturday, December 18, 2010 8:15 PM
> Subject: [anzhonda600owners] oil
> this is something i just wanted to pass along to anyone that might be more
> knowledgable about oils in engines. I have an ultralight airplane with a half VW
> engine in it and one of the gurus that builds these things had this to say
> about the oil: This message is to inform you about a problem with the new motor
> oils. There is a lot of information around about the reduction of ZDDP in oil
> formulations. ZDDP is an extreme lubricant additive. The oil companies are
> lowering the amounnt of it because of its effects on exhaust emissions. The VW
> engine needs the extra lubricant that ZDDP provides. With traditional oil
> formulations, I have had no problems reaching 1.000 hours time on an engine. I
> now have had two engines with approximately 350 hours wear out bearings. From
> what i see, its not a lack of oil pressure because both engines had good oil
> pressure and oil temperature. It just looks like the oil is not lubricating
> enough. What I am recomending is using either a diesel grade oil or a racing
> oil. Both have higher amounts of ZDDP. There are ZDDP additives also. Synthetic
> oils are not much better. I am by no means an expert scientist on this subject,
> but this is the only answer i have to hteis problem. Scott Casler, Hummel
> Engines I know he was writing this about VW engines but was
> wondering if it might be applies with the 600s? Tim

[Kukri]

Had anyone tried running V-Twin Mobile 1 20W50?

--- In
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
, "lyletrudell" wrote:
> I agree also, ZDDP is needed for all of our classic air cooled motorcycle engine designs. I will run a 20w-50 motorcycle oil. These oils are designed for high RPM/loads and also for transmission lubrication. Just what our Honda 600's need.
> A few bucks more but worth it!
> Lyle
> --- In
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
, Steven Michelsen wrote:
> > Yes, basically all correct. I have heard this: only buy oils that DON'T say "energy conserving" on the round label on the front, similar to these...
http://www.aa1car.com/library/API_donut.gif
. Hopefully someone with more understanding on this as it relates to 600s will chime in. Anyone here have an oil recommendation, given this issue?
> > Steve
> > www.honda600coupe.com
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: T W S
> > To:
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
> > Cc:
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Saturday, December 18, 2010 8:15 PM
> > Subject: [anzhonda600owners] oil
> > this is something i just wanted to pass along to anyone that might be more
> > knowledgable about oils in engines. I have an ultralight airplane with a half VW
> > engine in it and one of the gurus that builds these things had this to say
> > about the oil: This message is to inform you about a problem with the new motor
> > oils. There is a lot of information around about the reduction of ZDDP in oil
> > formulations. ZDDP is an extreme lubricant additive. The oil companies are
> > lowering the amounnt of it because of its effects on exhaust emissions. The VW
> > engine needs the extra lubricant that ZDDP provides. With traditional oil
> > formulations, I have had no problems reaching 1.000 hours time on an engine. I
> > now have had two engines with approximately 350 hours wear out bearings. From
> > what i see, its not a lack of oil pressure because both engines had good oil
> > pressure and oil temperature. It just looks like the oil is not lubricating
> > enough. What I am recomending is using either a diesel grade oil or a racing
> > oil. Both have higher amounts of ZDDP. There are ZDDP additives also. Synthetic
> > oils are not much better. I am by no means an expert scientist on this subject,
> > but this is the only answer i have to hteis problem. Scott Casler, Hummel
> > Engines I know he was writing this about VW engines but was
> > wondering if it might be applies with the 600s? Tim

[John]

Yes I have researched and ran a lot of different engines and what you all are saying is true, all our classic and older engines prior to 1996 need extra ZDDP. I like the product ZDDPLUS you can buy it from amazon.com or clarkscorvairs.com. I also will not ever run Valvoline oil in anything again as I along with other rodders in my area believe it is not good in any engine any more. Good luck to all.

--- In
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
, T W S wrote:
> this is something i just wanted to pass along to anyone that might be more
> knowledgable about oils in engines. I have an ultralight airplane with a half VW
> engine in it and one of the gurus that�builds these things had this to say
> about�the oil: This message is to inform you about a problem with the new motor
> oils. There is a lot of information around about the reduction of ZDDP in oil
> formulations. ZDDP is an extreme lubricant additive. The oil companies are
> lowering the amounnt of it because of its effects on exhaust emissions. The VW
> engine needs the extra lubricant that ZDDP provides. With traditional oil
> formulations, I have had no problems reaching 1.000 hours time on an engine. I
> now have had two engines with approximately 350 hours wear out bearings. From
> what i see, its not a lack of oil pressure because both engines had good oil
> pressure and oil temperature. It just looks like the oil is not lubricating
> enough. What I am recomending is using either a diesel grade oil or a racing
> oil. Both have higher amounts of ZDDP. There are ZDDP additives also. Synthetic
> oils are not much better. I am by no means an expert scientist on this subject,
> but this is the only answer i have to hteis problem. Scott Casler, Hummel
> Engines�������������� I know he was writing this about VW engines but was
> wondering if it might be applies with the 600s?��� Tim

[brad fenn]

John,I am not an oil scientist either. I know the 600 engines have roller bearing cranks,so I am not sure the ZDDP is needed for that,however the cam rides right in the aluminum cam holders and there are the timing chain slippers and the transmission gears that may benefit from it. I am however a Master VW Tech and run a shop that caters to the classic air cooled VWs. The unusual wear I see in the VW engines is the thrust part of the bearings wearing prematurely, mainly the cam thrust. Also have seen some extreme valve guide wear on some engines,but that could be due to Chinese valve guides. So I am believing this premature were in the VWs is due to the lack of ZDDP.  You mention a great dislike for Valvoline oil. I used to believe that was some of the best oil years back. What is your reason for that?
 I am also experiencing another issue that has to do with Todays fuel. I find that on a restored engine put all the way to factory specs that they will run lean. Discovered I have to increase jet size on the mains and idle jets to compensate for the Ethanol.  Plus the Ethanol appears to evaporate at a very fast rate, so the older cars with fuel tanks vented to the atmosphere tend to evaporate all there fuel away just being parked. Not to mention what the Ethanol dose to the tank and entire fuel system   Brad From:
John To:
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com Sent:
Mon, September 17, 2012 10:39:27 PM Subject:
[anzhonda600owners] Re: oil
Yes I have researched and ran a lot of different engines and what you all are saying is true, all our classic and older engines prior to 1996 need extra ZDDP. I like the product ZDDPLUS you can buy it from amazon.com or clarkscorvairs.com . I also will not ever run Valvoline oil in anything again as I along with other rodders in my area believe it is not good in any engine any more. Good luck to all.

--- In
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
, T W S wrote:
> this is something i just wanted to pass along to anyone that might be more
> knowledgable about oils in engines. I have an ultralight airplane with a half VW
> engine in it and one of the gurus that builds these things had this to say
> about the oil: This message is to inform you about a problem with the new motor
> oils. There is a lot of information around about the reduction of ZDDP in oil
> formulations. ZDDP is an extreme lubricant additive. The oil companies are
> lowering the amounnt of it because of its effects on exhaust emissions. The VW
> engine needs the extra lubricant that ZDDP provides. With traditional oil
> formulations, I have had no problems reaching 1.000 hours time on an engine. I
> now have had two engines with approximately 350 hours wear out bearings. From
> what i see, its not a lack of oil pressure because both engines had good oil
> pressure and oil temperature. It just looks like the oil is not lubricating
> enough. What I am recomending is using either a diesel grade oil or a racing
> oil. Both have higher amounts of ZDDP. There are ZDDP additives also. Synthetic
> oils are not much better. I am by no means an expert scientist on this subject,
> but this is the only answer i have to hteis problem. Scott Casler, Hummel
> Engines               I know he was writing this about VW engines but was
> wondering if it might be applies with the 600s?    Tim

[Lyle]

Hi Brad and John, like you both said our Honda engines do need an oil with high levels of ZDDP. I am not an oil expert either, but I have read and talked to the oil manufacturers. They say roller bearing cranks do need the ZDDP, because of the extreme pressure at the tangent point of a small diameter roller like our Honda cars and motorcycle engines use. Also cam lobe wear is a problem on all solid lifter engines. Among other issues Brad stated!
In our air cooled vintage Harley/Triumph motorcycles I use a 20w-50 Amsoil. http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/mcv.aspx
I run Shell Rotella 15w-40 in my 72 Honda Coupe, cheapest oil with pretty high levels of ZDDP. I don't beat on my Honda like I do my bikes.
Brad, I also found a leaner mixture using the ethanol fuels. Also on my Opel GT I get a vapor lock on a hot day and the fuel boils out the float bowl quicker.
I have been running 89oct ethanol free gas in my Honda at $4.50/gal.
I mix 50/50 in my Triumph and Opel.
So the oil cost more and it lubricates less. Our fuel costs more, produces less power and fuel mileage and destroys the rubber in our carbs. All this "new" stuff sucks!
Lyle

--- In
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
, brad fenn wrote:
> John,I am not an oil scientist either. I know the 600 engines have roller
> bearing cranks,so I am not sure the ZDDP is needed for that,however the cam
> rides right in the aluminum cam holders and there are the timing chain slippers
> and the transmission gears that may benefit from it. I am however a Master VW
> Tech and run a shop that caters to the classic air cooled VWs. The unusual wear
> I see in the VW engines is the thrust part of the bearings wearing prematurely,
> mainly the cam thrust. Also have seen some extreme valve guide wear on some
> engines,but that could be due to Chinese valve guides. So I am believing this
> premature were in the VWs is due to the lack of ZDDP. You mention a great
> dislike for Valvoline oil. I used to believe that was some of the best oil years
> back. What is your reason for that?
> I am also experiencing another issue that has to do with Todays fuel. I find
> that on a restored engine put all the way to factory specs that they will run
> lean. Discovered I have to increase jet size on the mains and idle jets to
> compensate for the Ethanol. Plus the Ethanol appears to evaporate at a very
> fast rate, so the older cars with fuel tanks vented to the atmosphere tend to
> evaporate all there fuel away just being parked. Not to mention what the Ethanol
> dose to the tank and entire fuel system Brad
> From: John
> To:
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Mon, September 17, 2012 10:39:27 PM
> Subject: [anzhonda600owners] Re: oil
> Yes I have researched and ran a lot of different engines and what you all are
> saying is true, all our classic and older engines prior to 1996 need extra ZDDP.
> I like the product ZDDPLUS you can buy it from amazon.com or clarkscorvairs.com.
> I also will not ever run Valvoline oil in anything again as I along with other
> rodders in my area believe it is not good in any engine any more. Good luck to
> all.
> --- In
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
, T W S wrote:
> > this is something i just wanted to pass along to anyone that might be more
> > knowledgable about oils in engines. I have an ultralight airplane with a half
> >VW
> > engine in it and one of the gurus that builds these things had this to say
> > about the oil: This message is to inform you about a problem with the new motor
> > oils. There is a lot of information around about the reduction of ZDDP in oil
> > formulations. ZDDP is an extreme lubricant additive. The oil companies are
> > lowering the amounnt of it because of its effects on exhaust emissions. The VW
> > engine needs the extra lubricant that ZDDP provides. With traditional oil
> > formulations, I have had no problems reaching 1.000 hours time on an engine. I
> > now have had two engines with approximately 350 hours wear out bearings. From
> > what i see, its not a lack of oil pressure because both engines had good oil
> > pressure and oil temperature. It just looks like the oil is not lubricating
> > enough. What I am recomending is using either a diesel grade oil or a racing
> > oil. Both have higher amounts of ZDDP. There are ZDDP additives also. Synthetic
> > oils are not much better. I am by no means an expert scientist on this subject,
> > but this is the only answer i have to hteis problem. Scott Casler, Hummel
> > Engines I know he was writing this about VW engines but was
> > wondering if it might be applies with the 600s? Tim

[John]

Brad, Yes I have researched and found the same, ZDDp is still needed for multiple reasons. I also used to believe Valvoline was tops and I have ran it for years in many engines fom classic muscle to modern muscle and marine and about everything in between. I have ran Valvoline in convention, synthetic, and racing formulas. I have found the same results on many motors reguardless of oil or engine brand or brand of parts in the engine. First all the engines I have ran valvoline in that have hydraulic lifters wont hold their prime when shut off no matter age or condition of the lifters and are inconsistent on valve lash, which we dont have to worry about with 600's. Next I have had numerous engines of different uses and brands end up needing new oil rings and valve seals I believe way before they should have. The government also removed the ZDDP out of all diesel oils now too unfortunate for us who used them for the ZDDP as now all diesel engines are full emmision controlled too. I know many people who use Amsoil and Royal Purple and have done so for years and have never had the issues I have had and they mantain their engines the same as I have, I know use royal purple and have for a couple years and my engines love it including my wife's 600 with some added ZDDPLUS.

--- In
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
, "John" wrote:
> Yes I have researched and ran a lot of different engines and what you all are saying is true, all our classic and older engines prior to 1996 need extra ZDDP. I like the product ZDDPLUS you can buy it from amazon.com or clarkscorvairs.com. I also will not ever run Valvoline oil in anything again as I along with other rodders in my area believe it is not good in any engine any more. Good luck to all.
> --- In
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
, T W S wrote:
> > this is something i just wanted to pass along to anyone that might be more
> > knowledgable about oils in engines. I have an ultralight airplane with a half VW
> > engine in it and one of the gurus that�builds these things had this to say
> > about�the oil: This message is to inform you about a problem with the new motor
> > oils. There is a lot of information around about the reduction of ZDDP in oil
> > formulations. ZDDP is an extreme lubricant additive. The oil companies are
> > lowering the amounnt of it because of its effects on exhaust emissions. The VW
> > engine needs the extra lubricant that ZDDP provides. With traditional oil
> > formulations, I have had no problems reaching 1.000 hours time on an engine. I
> > now have had two engines with approximately 350 hours wear out bearings. From
> > what i see, its not a lack of oil pressure because both engines had good oil
> > pressure and oil temperature. It just looks like the oil is not lubricating
> > enough. What I am recomending is using either a diesel grade oil or a racing
> > oil. Both have higher amounts of ZDDP. There are ZDDP additives also. Synthetic
> > oils are not much better. I am by no means an expert scientist on this subject,
> > but this is the only answer i have to hteis problem. Scott Casler, Hummel
> > Engines�������������� I know he was writing this about VW engines but was
> > wondering if it might be applies with the 600s?��� Tim

[richmccolman]

Thanks for alerting us to the ZDDP issue. I was previously unaware.
Investigation I've done online appears to indicate that Castrol GTX 20w50 still has an appreciable amount of ZDDP, though I'm not 100% convinced it's in the "safe" range. I ordered some ZDDPlus to add in at oil changes, just to be sure. (I've read that too much ZDDP can cause problems, so I'll likely put in a bit less than the average recommended amount, since the Castrol 20w50 supposedly has more ZDDP than many other oils.)
I contemplated going with Amsoil or Royal Purple, but since I don't put gobs of miles on the car between six-month oil changes (I mainly just drive it around a little on weekends), and since I'm not sure about the condition of the engine's seals or whether the synthetic oil will tend to leak past the seals more than conventional oils, I figured I'd not spring for the synthetics at this time.
Thanks again,
Richard

--- In
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
, "John" wrote:
> Brad, Yes I have researched and found the same, ZDDp is still needed for multiple reasons. I also used to believe Valvoline was tops and I have ran it for years in many engines fom classic muscle to modern muscle and marine and about everything in between. I have ran Valvoline in convention, synthetic, and racing formulas. I have found the same results on many motors reguardless of oil or engine brand or brand of parts in the engine. First all the engines I have ran valvoline in that have hydraulic lifters wont hold their prime when shut off no matter age or condition of the lifters and are inconsistent on valve lash, which we dont have to worry about with 600's. Next I have had numerous engines of different uses and brands end up needing new oil rings and valve seals I believe way before they should have. The government also removed the ZDDP out of all diesel oils now too unfortunate for us who used them for the ZDDP as now all diesel engines are full emmision controlled too. I know many people who use Amsoil and Royal Purple and have done so for years and have never had the issues I have had and they mantain their engines the same as I have, I know use royal purple and have for a couple years and my engines love it including my wife's 600 with some added ZDDPLUS.
> --- In
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
, "John" wrote:
> > Yes I have researched and ran a lot of different engines and what you all are saying is true, all our classic and older engines prior to 1996 need extra ZDDP. I like the product ZDDPLUS you can buy it from amazon.com or clarkscorvairs.com. I also will not ever run Valvoline oil in anything again as I along with other rodders in my area believe it is not good in any engine any more. Good luck to all.
> > --- In
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
, T W S wrote:
> > > this is something i just wanted to pass along to anyone that might be more
> > > knowledgable about oils in engines. I have an ultralight airplane with a half VW
> > > engine in it and one of the gurus that�builds these things had this to say
> > > about�the oil: This message is to inform you about a problem with the new motor
> > > oils. There is a lot of information around about the reduction of ZDDP in oil
> > > formulations. ZDDP is an extreme lubricant additive. The oil companies are
> > > lowering the amounnt of it because of its effects on exhaust emissions. The VW
> > > engine needs the extra lubricant that ZDDP provides. With traditional oil
> > > formulations, I have had no problems reaching 1.000 hours time on an engine. I
> > > now have had two engines with approximately 350 hours wear out bearings. From
> > > what i see, its not a lack of oil pressure because both engines had good oil
> > > pressure and oil temperature. It just looks like the oil is not lubricating
> > > enough. What I am recomending is using either a diesel grade oil or a racing
> > > oil. Both have higher amounts of ZDDP. There are ZDDP additives also. Synthetic
> > > oils are not much better. I am by no means an expert scientist on this subject,
> > > but this is the only answer i have to hteis problem. Scott Casler, Hummel
> > > Engines�������������� I know he was writing this about VW engines but was
> > > wondering if it might be applies with the 600s?��� Tim

[tommyjayallen]

I have been driving 600's since 73 and have always used Castrol GTX. There should be no need to add aditional ZDDP to the oil. The car I currently am driving has had continuous use since 1984 and has never had any problems. I also drive the crap out of it. It never gets babied. 300,000 miles and counting.
From:
richmccolman To:
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com Sent:
Saturday, September 29, 2012 5:19 PM Subject:
[anzhonda600owners] Re: oil
Thanks for alerting us to the ZDDP issue. I was previously unaware.
Investigation I've done online appears to indicate that Castrol GTX 20w50 still has an appreciable amount of ZDDP, though I'm not 100% convinced it's in the "safe" range. I ordered some ZDDPlus to add in at oil changes, just to be sure. (I've read that too much ZDDP can cause problems, so I'll likely put in a bit less than the average recommended amount, since the Castrol 20w50 supposedly has more ZDDP than many other oils.) I contemplated going with Amsoil or Royal Purple, but since I don't put gobs of miles on the car between six-month oil changes (I mainly just drive it around a little on weekends), and since I'm not sure about the condition of the engine's seals or whether the synthetic oil will tend to leak past the seals more than conventional oils, I figured I'd not spring for the synthetics at this time.
Thanks again, Richard --- In mailto:anzhonda600owners%40yahoogroups.com , "John" wrote:

> Brad, Yes I have researched and found the same, ZDDp is still needed for multiple reasons. I also used to believe Valvoline was tops and I have ran it for years in many engines fom classic muscle to modern muscle and marine and about everything in between. I have ran Valvoline in convention, synthetic, and racing formulas. I have found the same results on many motors reguardless of oil or engine brand or brand of parts in the engine. First all the engines I have ran valvoline in that have hydraulic lifters wont hold their prime when shut off no matter age or condition of the lifters and are inconsistent on valve lash, which we dont have to worry about with 600's. Next I have had numerous engines of different uses and brands end

up needing new oil rings and valve seals I believe way before they should have. The government also removed the ZDDP out of all diesel oils now too unfortunate for us who used them for the ZDDP as now all diesel engines are full emmision controlled too. I know many people who use Amsoil and Royal Purple and have done so for years and have never had the issues I have had and they mantain their engines the same as I have, I know use royal purple and have for a couple years and my engines love it including my wife's 600 with some added ZDDPLUS.

> --- In
mailto:anzhonda600owners%40yahoogroups.com
, "John" wrote:
> > Yes I have researched and ran a lot of different engines and what you all are saying is true, all our classic and older engines prior to 1996 need extra

ZDDP. I like the product ZDDPLUS you can buy it from amazon.com or clarkscorvairs.com . I also will not ever run Valvoline oil in anything again as I along with other rodders in my area believe it is not good in any engine any more. Good luck to all.

> > --- In
mailto:anzhonda600owners%40yahoogroups.com
, T W S wrote:
> > > this is something i just wanted to pass along to anyone that might be more > > > knowledgable about oils in engines. I have an ultralight airplane with a half VW > > > engine in it and one of the gurus that builds these things had this to say > > > about the oil: This message is to inform you about a problem with the new motor
> > > oils. There is a lot of information around about the reduction of ZDDP in oil > > > formulations. ZDDP is an extreme lubricant additive. The oil companies are > > > lowering the amounnt of it because of its effects on exhaust emissions. The VW > > > engine needs the extra lubricant that ZDDP provides. With traditional oil > > > formulations, I have had no problems reaching 1.000 hours time on an engine. I > > > now have had two engines with approximately 350 hours wear out bearings. From > > > what i see, its not a lack of oil pressure because both engines had good oil > > > pressure and oil temperature. It just looks like the oil is not lubricating > > > enough. What I am recomending is using either a diesel grade oil or a racing > > > oil. Both have higher amounts of ZDDP. There are ZDDP additives also. Synthetic
> > > oils are not much better. I am by no means an expert scientist on this subject, > > > but this is the only answer i have to hteis problem. Scott Casler, Hummel > > > Engines               I know he was writing this about VW engines but was > > > wondering if it might be applies with the 600s?    Tim