Have you (and your various car clubs) looked at Red Line Oil for use in your vehicles? I was looking at the specs on their auto and motorcycle oil and they seem to have everything you would desire for lubricating qualities. They have 10W-40 and 20W-50 grades plus others.
Dale
> Hey good info!
> Using a straight 50w oil might be a good idea in our
> Honda's that are used in hot climates. 40W in cooler climates. With high > levels of ZDP.
> So we agree:
> *Air cooled engines heat up very
> quick.
> *Our engines have looser clearances.
> *We have blow bye from the
> rings.
> *No valve seals.
> *Short run times & high
> RPM's.
> *Transmission uses the same oil.
> *We only have about 3 quarts of
> oil to work with, so it gets dirty and diluted very fast.
> *New oils have
> less or no ZDP.
> No wonder the engines are worn out after 70K
> miles!
> The thought of using a multigrade 20w-50 was quick flow to the > bearings as a 20w and the protection of a 50w when it warms up.
> But, maybe
> we don't need this.
> A motorcycle oil might be a good way to go. Not
> sure about how much ZDP is in them, but it should be much higher than auto > oil.
> Something to check on.
> Thanks for the imput.
> Lyle
> ---
> In
> anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
> ,
> brad fenn wrote:
> > I would tend to
> agree with bill on this one. I worked for VW back in the 70s and > > 80s > and it was recommended to run single viscosity oils in the air cooled
> engines, 30w in the winter and 40w in the summer. And I raced VWs for years > and > > always ran 50w racing oil in them and never had an engine > failure. Also the air > > cooled engines temperatures run in extremes and > change rapidly. VWs ran oil > > coolers from the factory .It was always > recommended to run bigger oil coolers > > for racing as the oil did take > part in the cooling of the engine. So I would > > believe that running an > external filter and cooler would be very helpful in not > > only helping > the engine run cleaner and cooler that the extra oil capacity would
> take longer to break down. And as far as the thinner grades of oil being used
> > in the newer cars, yes the clearances are much tighter,and with the > help of the > > newer synthetics they can run a very thin viscosity oil.
> Part of the reason they
> > do this is to increase the fuel mileage on
> these newer cars. But for these older
> > cars, use a thicker oil.
> Anyway, that is my opinion. Brad
> > From: "billmyong@..."
>
> > To:
> anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Wed, July 21, 2010 11:48:02 PM
> > Subject: RE: [anzhonda600owners]
> Re: 20W-50 oil??
> > Really;
> > Normally I
> agree to most information put on the site. But, thinner grades of > > oil > 5W30 and the like are there because of the closer tolerances most new
> engines have. Thicker oils like 20W50 and up are used in engines that have
> > wear. ZDDP and other additives have limited qualities. Like STP, I > used to > > run it in my 65 Chevy Nova because it didn't smoke (as much) > as long as I had a > > couple of quarts of the stuff in my engine. It > didn't help the wear any, as > > it didn't replace any of the metal. Take > a look at the site below and see > > what others are saying.
> http://www.nordicgr
> oup.us/oil. htm#Thicker%
> 20is%20Better% 20Myth
> > Change the oil, use a good filter and
> things should go well.
> > Just remember one thing, these
> engines (the Honda 600) are high revving and
> > warm up quickly. The
> warmer the metal parts are in your engine the greater
> > chance of wear.
> Heat also breaks down the viscosity oil, removing the heat > > will allow > the oil to retain it's viscosity, which allows the oil to keep a thin
> coating on the cylinder walls.
> > Bill
> > -----Original Message-----
> > >From: anzhonda600owners@
> yahoogroups. com [mailto:anzhonda600
> > >owners@yahoogrou ps.com]On
> Behalf Of goinhm@...
> > >Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 8:21
> PM
> > >To: anzhonda600owners@ yahoogroups. com
> > >Subject:
> Re: [anzhonda600owners] Re: 20W-50 oil??
> >Hi Lyle,
> > > Thanks for this info on the oils and
> ZDP. I did do a search on the
> > >keywords you suggested and saw lots
> of info from motorcycle and car clubs
> > >plus companies selling
> lubrication products. Looks like ZDP is a desirable
> > >additive for
> our cars and cannot doing any harm to them. I also did a search
> >on the keywords
> > >"SAE oil ZDP" to see what info was available
> from the auto manufacturer
> > >side. This also had lots of good info
> with background on ZDP and the backward
> > >compatibility of new oils
> with older engines. One SAE article pretty much
> > >said that unless
> your engine has high valve train forces such as a 60s Dodge > > >Hemi, > the modern motor oils will work fine and they were developed to be
> >backward compatible with older engines.
> > > The actual SAE site has many articles on lubrication but they > are for > > >sale. So, then it requires some extra effort to find > someone who has posted > > >the article (or condensed version of it) > elsewhere on the web. Anyone on > > >here have a copy of the SAE 2004 > Powertrain Conference?
> > > Months ago, I saw someone
> make a post recommending using an oil
> > >formulated for motorcycles.
> That is probably not a bad idea since the oil is
> > >intended for
> systems where the engine and tranny share the same lubrication.
> >And maybe they put some ZDP in it.
> > >thanks again,
> Lyle, for your comments,
> > >Dale
> > >Oil is a big issue with
> this engine. Dale, like you said, changing it more
> > >often, using a
> good oil and maybe an oil cooler is the key.
> >>But, our engine oils have changed over the past 2-5 years!
> >>In some ways better with multi-grades that have a wider viscosity > range > > >>than years ago.
> > >>Also worse with
> Anti-wear additives being removed, the most common zinc
> >>dithiophosphate (ZDP), which is a combination of zinc and phosphorus.
> Taken
> > >>out because it will hurt the catalytic converters on
> the newer cars, which
> > >>now have roller cams/lifters.
> >>I have a 70 Opel GT and 59 Triumph TR3 and our clubs have been > researching > > >>and testing this for years. The conclusion is we > need this in our flat > > >>tappet engines.
> > >>Most
> motorcycles also have the same issue.
> > >>One of the oils we
> decided to use in the cars is Rotella-T 15W-40 for diesel
> >>engines, because of the higher levels of (ZDP) and it's available
> > >>everywhere and cheap. Some also add a 1/2 can of STP in > hotter climates.
> > >>In my Motorcycle engines I use CastrolActevo
> 20w-50.
> > >>Watch out, most oils like castrol, valvoline and
> others have removed the
> > >>(ZDP)and they don't say they removed
> it! Rotella still has it as of the new
> > >>year.
> > >>Don't run a straight 50 weight oil, a multi-grade is
> best for these engines
> > >>because of varying temperature
> ranges.
> > >>The Honda engine:
> > >>*Is
> a flat tappet engine.
> > >>*Roller bearings running on a crank
> with no sleeves.
> > >>*It uses aluminum as a bearing
> surface.
> > >>*Very low oil pressure to the bearings if
> any.
> > >>*A piston type oil pump.
> > >>*Air
> cooled.
> > >>How does your Honda engine look after
> 75K miles? Worn and the clearances
> > >>are now greater just like
> all my engines.
> > >>It's your engine, do some
> research, type in(ZDP air cooled motorcycle
> > >>engines)and you
> will know more about oil and additives than you ever wanted
> >>to.
> > >>I say in warmer climates use 15w-40 or 20w-50 with
> a high level of (ZDP).
> > >>Just my 2 cents, minus taxes!
> >>Lyle